XC Nation Reports NXN at large bids doesn't include Chantilly
11/25/2012 6:56:30 PM
Coach
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 27
I am wondering what other coaches think about the decision to run McGorty separate from his team at NXN, losing on the tie breaker and then missing out on a team accomplishment. If i were the Chantilly #3-5 runners I might be a bit miffed.
I am wondering what other coaches think about the decision to run McGorty separate from his team at NXN, losing on the tie breaker and then missing out on a team accomplishment. If i were the Chantilly #3-5 runners I might be a bit miffed.
11/25/2012 10:27:28 PM
Coach
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 609
@CoachCuthbert Well, the coach doesn't have authority at this point. The season ended at states and the kids are running for clubs, not schools. This was Sean's decision. I doubt the kids are upset with Sean. They're runners; they understand what it means to be a Foot Locker champion. Sean was unbelievable Saturday. He won with class despite really dominating the field and he deserves nothing but praise for what he's done. I do think it's a shame they didn't get an at-large bid, however.
@CoachCuthbert

Well, the coach doesn't have authority at this point. The season ended at states and the kids are running for clubs, not schools. This was Sean's decision. I doubt the kids are upset with Sean. They're runners; they understand what it means to be a Foot Locker champion. Sean was unbelievable Saturday. He won with class despite really dominating the field and he deserves nothing but praise for what he's done.

I do think it's a shame they didn't get an at-large bid, however.
11/25/2012 10:53:14 PM
User
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 3
Does anyone know what Nike's criteria for at-large teams are. Because obviously if Sean was with the team they would have won. It makes no sense to me that they wouldn't be included if they barely lost out without their top runner. Is it possible that Nike is punishing the team for letting Sean race in their rival postseason championships, Footlocker?
Does anyone know what Nike's criteria for at-large teams are. Because obviously if Sean was with the team they would have won. It makes no sense to me that they wouldn't be included if they barely lost out without their top runner. Is it possible that Nike is punishing the team for letting Sean race in their rival postseason championships, Footlocker?
11/25/2012 11:50:49 PM
Coach
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 609
@lbdistance12 I wondered the same thing. I hope that's not the case because that would be awfully petty. I'm going to choose to believe they just had some truly, truly awesome teams in other parts of the country none of our schools could match up against.
@lbdistance12

I wondered the same thing. I hope that's not the case because that would be awfully petty. I'm going to choose to believe they just had some truly, truly awesome teams in other parts of the country none of our schools could match up against.
11/26/2012 12:32:56 AM
Power User
SUBSCRIBER
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 414
Respectfully, the decisions made in regards to NXN and Footlocker were very much team decisions, including input from the coaches and runners alike. Sean has supported the team all season, and in return his teammates have respected his goals after states. Footlocker was to be our primary focus all along, and we sent a team to NXN to allow the other members to continue their season, and try to roll the dice as it pertains to qualifying for Oregon. We ran 6 runners this weekend in the two meets and all if them ran personal bests, or close to them. We were certainly disappointed that the NXN chose to ignore our boys performance this weekend, if not the whole season, but that was not something in our control. It is certainly not a slight on his part, the coaching staff, or anyone else...it was not our decision to make. In the end, there are only so many races you can run, or trips you make and we don't regret our teams choices in this regard. We are proud of all of the team success this fall, and everyone from CHS is whole-hearted lay supporting Logan in Portland next week, and Sean in San Diego the week after.
Respectfully, the decisions made in regards to NXN and Footlocker were very much team decisions, including input from the coaches and runners alike. Sean has supported the team all season, and in return his teammates have respected his goals after states. Footlocker was to be our primary focus all along, and we sent a team to NXN to allow the other members to continue their season, and try to roll the dice as it pertains to qualifying for Oregon. We ran 6 runners this weekend in the two meets and all if them ran personal bests, or close to them. We were certainly disappointed that the NXN chose to ignore our boys performance this weekend, if not the whole season, but that was not something in our control. It is certainly not a slight on his part, the coaching staff, or anyone else...it was not our decision to make. In the end, there are only so many races you can run, or trips you make and we don't regret our teams choices in this regard.

We are proud of all of the team success this fall, and everyone from CHS is whole-hearted lay supporting Logan in Portland next week, and Sean in San Diego the week after.
11/26/2012 8:15:28 AM
Coach
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 22
i know as a fan i am much, much more interested in seeing him run at footlocker than i would be in seeing him or his team run at nike. that kid is quite possibly the greatest xc runner this state has ever produced. it would be a real shame if he didn't run footlocker so his team could make a trip and most likely get beat badly at nike. also, there was no guarantee his team would make it even if he had run at nike regions. there was a very good chance that he would run with his team and they still would not make it to nationals. it's only through hindsight that anyone is debating this. no one is blaming sophie chase for running footlocker, nor should they. but plenty of other kids made the same decisions as sean m.
i know as a fan i am much, much more interested in seeing him run at footlocker than i would be in seeing him or his team run at nike. that kid is quite possibly the greatest xc runner this state has ever produced. it would be a real shame if he didn't run footlocker so his team could make a trip and most likely get beat badly at nike. also, there was no guarantee his team would make it even if he had run at nike regions. there was a very good chance that he would run with his team and they still would not make it to nationals. it's only through hindsight that anyone is debating this. no one is blaming sophie chase for running footlocker, nor should they. but plenty of other kids made the same decisions as sean m.
11/26/2012 11:11:19 AM
User
SUBSCRIBER
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 388
Nike does not like to finished second to Footlocker. They hold a grudge.
Nike does not like to finished second to Footlocker. They hold a grudge.
11/26/2012 11:15:39 AM
Coach
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 609
@KYinNC I hope you're wrong. Adults should be better than, especially when dealing with kids.
@KYinNC

I hope you're wrong. Adults should be better than, especially when dealing with kids.
11/26/2012 11:20:59 AM
Power User
SUBSCRIBER
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 188
@KYinNC As someone who works for both the regional (NE/NY) and national Nike meets I can tell you that there is no way that Nike "held a grudge" and punished the team or Sean. If you say that you simply don't know what you're talking about. Do we like to lose a great runner to FL? Heck no but I would bet anything the Fl people would say the exact same thing about losing runners to NXN. That's just natural but there is no way that the people who run either event would be vindictive or do anything to hurt an athlete or a team.
@KYinNC As someone who works for both the regional (NE/NY) and national Nike meets I can tell you that there is no way that Nike "held a grudge" and punished the team or Sean. If you say that you simply don't know what you're talking about. Do we like to lose a great runner to FL? Heck no but I would bet anything the Fl people would say the exact same thing about losing runners to NXN. That's just natural but there is no way that the people who run either event would be vindictive or do anything to hurt an athlete or a team.
11/26/2012 11:23:15 AM
Coach
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 609
@CoachDSM I hope my reply sounded like I was on your side on this. I was sure the team had discussed all of this and were on the same page. I couldn't imagine a group of kids on a cross country team begrudging their number one runner the chance at Foot Locker. I wanted to point out that the season ends at states. We as coaches can't require kids to run other races after that (at least in the VHSL schools). I don't think there's anything wrong with a kid saying, "I'm running for the team in the VHSL season, but after the season I've got goals I have to pursue." It sounds like that's exactly what happened and the team handled everything perfectly. The one runner does a lot for the 2 through 5 runners, sometimes the 2 through 5 runners sacrifice for the one runner. That's what "team" is about. I'm even more impressed by these kids now.
@CoachDSM

I hope my reply sounded like I was on your side on this. I was sure the team had discussed all of this and were on the same page. I couldn't imagine a group of kids on a cross country team begrudging their number one runner the chance at Foot Locker.

I wanted to point out that the season ends at states. We as coaches can't require kids to run other races after that (at least in the VHSL schools). I don't think there's anything wrong with a kid saying, "I'm running for the team in the VHSL season, but after the season I've got goals I have to pursue." It sounds like that's exactly what happened and the team handled everything perfectly. The one runner does a lot for the 2 through 5 runners, sometimes the 2 through 5 runners sacrifice for the one runner. That's what "team" is about. I'm even more impressed by these kids now.
11/26/2012 12:05:37 PM
Power User
SUBSCRIBER
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 414
@mattymath I understand you are on our side with this...no problem. I was just clarifying what transpired from our end. I am willing to concede that there may or may not be some backroom politics that happens in the decision-making, but the men who decide who goes on as a wild-card have a thankless job. No matter who they choose, they will please four teams, and disappoint others. It is what it is. I don't think a grudge was held against Sean....NIKE was good enough to invite Sean to their Elite Mile camp last June. My perspective is certainly biased in favor of my kids, but I will be the first one to congratulate the teams who are advancing, and say that I am sure they are as worthy as I think our kids are. Comparing performances of teams who are on different courses, against different competition, on opposite sides of the country, is a difficult task. Lastly, I will state that I agree that what happens after the VHSL season is more or less up to the athlete. I think that we as coaches have tried to do the best to meet the goals of all of our runners, as a team and as individuals, and do so in a manner that suits everyone involved. I know what the rules state (Club vs. team), but in reality, this is people dealing with people, and I know that even though some of the Chargers were disappointed yesterday, you move on to new goals in the next season. Best of luck to Coach DeMarco and the Blacksburg Boys....I hope you represent the state well this weekend.
@mattymath

I understand you are on our side with this...no problem. I was just clarifying what transpired from our end.

I am willing to concede that there may or may not be some backroom politics that happens in the decision-making, but the men who decide who goes on as a wild-card have a thankless job. No matter who they choose, they will please four teams, and disappoint others. It is what it is. I don't think a grudge was held against Sean....NIKE was good enough to invite Sean to their Elite Mile camp last June. My perspective is certainly biased in favor of my kids, but I will be the first one to congratulate the teams who are advancing, and say that I am sure they are as worthy as I think our kids are. Comparing performances of teams who are on different courses, against different competition, on opposite sides of the country, is a difficult task.

Lastly, I will state that I agree that what happens after the VHSL season is more or less up to the athlete. I think that we as coaches have tried to do the best to meet the goals of all of our runners, as a team and as individuals, and do so in a manner that suits everyone involved. I know what the rules state (Club vs. team), but in reality, this is people dealing with people, and I know that even though some of the Chargers were disappointed yesterday, you move on to new goals in the next season.

Best of luck to Coach DeMarco and the Blacksburg Boys....I hope you represent the state well this weekend.
11/26/2012 12:36:21 PM
User
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 6
I think we have to accept that Sean McGorty and Sophie Chase (almost identical scenario) made what I'm sure was a very tough decision to run as individuals. They have earned the right to make that choice. I’m very glad to hear it was a team decision and everyone accepted all possible outcomes. They supported their teams during the school year and both teams had incredible years and were nationally recognized. They join a long list of runners that had to make that same choice since NTN was introduced. I think we also have to respect that Nike had to make a decision based on the teams/runners that ran at regionals. They have no guarantee that these individuals would join their respective teams and run hard 3 weeks in a row. The traveling alone would be exhausting. I'm not sure if Nike has ever set this “what if” precedence in the past. If they have, then their is reason to question the selection. You can call NXN a true National Championship for high school cross country teams, but since NTN/NXN and Foot Locker have both existed and fight for the best individuals, in my opinion Foot Locker only has a slight edge because so many of the nations best individuals also run on national class teams. I think it is in the culture of some teams that the season doesn't end until after NXN. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying that is right or wrong. If you look at historically powerful teams such as Fayetteville Manlius and Saratoga, I would guess the decision to run as a team is made for them when they join the program. The opportunity to run in Oregon and represent your school (club as they call it) with great pride is a dream of a lifetime for most teams. They will remember being treated like kings and queens for the rest of their lives. For other teams it is expected (almost business like) and the runners on those teams have to work harder than they could ever imagine to be in the top 7 to make the trip. Congrats to all of the teams and individuals that represented Virginia very well at both Foot Locker and NXN! Virginia has some amazing student athletes heading to both locations! They should be proud and enjoy the trips, they earned it.
I think we have to accept that Sean McGorty and Sophie Chase (almost identical scenario) made what I'm sure was a very tough decision to run as individuals. They have earned the right to make that choice. I'm very glad to hear it was a team decision and everyone accepted all possible outcomes. They supported their teams during the school year and both teams had incredible years and were nationally recognized. They join a long list of runners that had to make that same choice since NTN was introduced. I think we also have to respect that Nike had to make a decision based on the teams/runners that ran at regionals. They have no guarantee that these individuals would join their respective teams and run hard 3 weeks in a row. The traveling alone would be exhausting. I'm not sure if Nike has ever set this "what if" precedence in the past. If they have, then their is reason to question the selection.

You can call NXN a true National Championship for high school cross country teams, but since NTN/NXN and Foot Locker have both existed and fight for the best individuals, in my opinion Foot Locker only has a slight edge because so many of the nations best individuals also run on national class teams. I think it is in the culture of some teams that the season doesn't end until after NXN. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that is right or wrong. If you look at historically powerful teams such as Fayetteville Manlius and Saratoga, I would guess the decision to run as a team is made for them when they join the program. The opportunity to run in Oregon and represent your school (club as they call it) with great pride is a dream of a lifetime for most teams. They will remember being treated like kings and queens for the rest of their lives. For other teams it is expected (almost business like) and the runners on those teams have to work harder than they could ever imagine to be in the top 7 to make the trip.

Congrats to all of the teams and individuals that represented Virginia very well at both Foot Locker and NXN! Virginia has some amazing student athletes heading to both locations! They should be proud and enjoy the trips, they earned it.
11/26/2012 1:07:53 PM
Coach
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 32
The Southeast could fix this if they held the Footlocker and NXN qualifiers on separate days. Most other regions do as well but the Southeast I guess refuses to budge on dates. Congrats to Blacksburg on making it and good luck to Sean McGorty at footlocker and Logan Miller making it individually to NXN! Do work Boys!
The Southeast could fix this if they held the Footlocker and NXN qualifiers on separate days. Most other regions do as well but the Southeast I guess refuses to budge on dates. Congrats to Blacksburg on making it and good luck to Sean McGorty at footlocker and Logan Miller making it individually to NXN! Do work Boys!
11/27/2012 6:34:56 PM
User
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3
Saturday was an amazing day for Chantilly cross country. With Sean McGorty winning Footlocker South and the rest of the team coming so close to their goal of qualifying the team for nike so Sean could run both championships. If Chantilly numb 4 runner was able to run, the result might have been different. My son is that runner and is still recovering from a hip injury that sidelined him for the post season. His coach and doctor advised him not to run if any pain was present. Thus, no Chantilly number 6 runner in Saturdays race. Blacksburg is a great team and had an outstanding season so will represent Virginia well on Saturday. My opinion is that Chantilly should have got an at large bid. They have ranked in the US top 15 all year. Other teams selected were lower ranked. Logan Miller will carry the Chantilly flag and perform well. Thanks boys and coaches for an amazing season! 1st Place: Monroe Parker, Oatlands, Octoberfest, Glory Days, Concorde District, Northern Region, VA AAA State 3rd: Nike SE Region 4th: Great America CC Festival
Saturday was an amazing day for Chantilly cross country. With Sean McGorty winning Footlocker South and the rest of the team coming so close to their goal of qualifying the team for nike so Sean could run both championships. If Chantilly numb 4 runner was able to run, the result might have been different. My son is that runner and is still recovering from a hip injury that sidelined him for the post season. His coach and doctor advised him not to run if any pain was present. Thus, no Chantilly number 6 runner in Saturdays race. Blacksburg is a great team and had an outstanding season so will represent Virginia well on Saturday. My opinion is that Chantilly should have got an at large bid. They have ranked in the US top 15 all year. Other teams selected were lower ranked. Logan Miller will carry the Chantilly flag and perform well. Thanks boys and coaches for an amazing season!

1st Place: Monroe Parker, Oatlands, Octoberfest, Glory Days, Concorde District, Northern Region, VA AAA State

3rd: Nike SE Region

4th: Great America CC Festival
01/06/2013 9:57:20 AM
Coach
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 609
Nike might not have intentionally been biased, they just think we can't run in the South. So it's not evil. It's just ingrained. They probably think the Big 10 plays the best football, too.
Nike might not have intentionally been biased, they just think we can't run in the South. So it's not evil. It's just ingrained. They probably think the Big 10 plays the best football, too.

You must be logged in to comment.

Click Here to Log In.